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I was watching Combat again last night (my DVD's have only just arrived, growl), and I saw, or thought I saw, something odd.
When the muppet who had been running the fight club thing stepped into the cage at the end of the episode, Jack was pointing his gun at the Weevil. Now, it may have been my overactive imagination, but it looked to me like he lowered his gun, the Weevil stayed where it was watching Jack as well as the bloke. It didn't move until Jack inclined his head slightly in the bloke's direction, either instructing it, or giving it permission, to attack. Then when the camera cut back to Jack's face, there was this look of, kind of, satisfaction.
Is there a possibility that Jack is better able to communicate with/understand Weevils on the telepathic or emapthic wavelength they seem to posess than he wants to let on to his team?
It wouldn't be the first time, would it?
When the muppet who had been running the fight club thing stepped into the cage at the end of the episode, Jack was pointing his gun at the Weevil. Now, it may have been my overactive imagination, but it looked to me like he lowered his gun, the Weevil stayed where it was watching Jack as well as the bloke. It didn't move until Jack inclined his head slightly in the bloke's direction, either instructing it, or giving it permission, to attack. Then when the camera cut back to Jack's face, there was this look of, kind of, satisfaction.
Is there a possibility that Jack is better able to communicate with/understand Weevils on the telepathic or emapthic wavelength they seem to posess than he wants to let on to his team?
It wouldn't be the first time, would it?
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I do think though that Jack is intelligent, perceptive, and good at non-verbal communication. He knew what Janet was thinking and what was about to happen. I think Janet looked to him as her packleader. (I'm making an analogy here, not an assumption about Weevil culture.)
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Gah! For some reason the font for your reply box is too tiny to see. Apologies for any spelling errors, but I have no clue what the letters are.
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I don't think anyone's psychic. Jack's got enough weird going on, and Gwen is already enough of a mary-sue. If one of them turns out to be psychic, I won't be amused.
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- she saw the fairies out of the corner of her eye, when others didn't
- she could perceive Eugene's ghost, though not clearly
- she looks like Gwyneth
- she makes good intuitive guesses, e.g., that Jack knew Estelle in 1944
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Actually if anything, it's Owen who may turn out to have the most understanding of weevils. Jack did say to Ianto that Owen had been studying them for a while.
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- she saw the fairies out of the corner of her eye, when others didn't. I kinda got the impression that Jack had seen them previously
- she could perceive Eugene's ghost, though not clearly. He had a crush on her, he was totally focused on her, maybe that was more him than her.
- she looks like Gwyneth. Pass, never saw that episode,
- she makes good intuitive guesses, e.g., that Jack knew Estelle in 1944. She saw the photo's in Estelle's living room, and already doubted that it was Jack's father. Him upset over Estelle just confirmed her suspicions.
On an entirely unconnected note, I have no idea why my reply box/text have shrunk so much. Anyone have a clue how I can fix it?
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Your textbox problem is in your stylesheet. I haven't got all my web tools loaded on this version of Firefox, so I can't tell you exactly what the problem is though.
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The other stuff though, does make me wonder.
Oh, and sorry for just butting in here but you've got me intruiged.
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Also, I'm not a Gwen fan but to me, I can hardly see her as truely caring of other people's feelings to be honest - horny yes, she's screwing Owen and Rhys and has her sights set on Jack, and doesn't seem to care if she hurts them in the process. Does that truely scream emphatic? Let alone psychic.
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Connecting Jack and Estelle - I'd rather put it to the fact, that she new that Jack can't die. If she thought he was "mere mortal", I don't think she would have made that leap.
And yes, Gwen maybe is more sympathetic and caring, than others. Or at least she's showing it more, than others. But I don't think it makes her special in psychic way.
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I wouldn't call it evidence, either, but it's a reason: there's no need to think within the text here. They gave a reason for Martha Jones' resemblanced to the character in the role she had in Doctor Who's "Army of Ghosts": they said Adeola was Martha's cousin. They have given no reason for Gwen's resemblance to Gwyneth, and though she could be a relative, she can't be a descendent, and reincarnation is ruled out in a show that states there is 'nothing' after death. A thematic link remains possible.
Feel free to butt in! I find it an interesting topic.
Another reason for me to wonder is that Jack's motivation for hiring Gwen seemed thin to me, given her set of skills. If he saw something in her that most people can't see - such as psychic abilities - it would explain why he thought she would be an asset to the team. It would explain why he's trying to get her to think in non-linear ways. It would explain why the first thing he did when she got into the Hub in "Everything Changes" was to take her to see the Weevil and to look into its eyes.
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he was very understanding in that one....
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Why think that? We know the Doctor is capable of telepathy; we saw it in action in "The Girl in the Fireplace". We know Gwyneth had special abilities.
I don't think Torchwood has any limits to how far it can go.
What does being psychic have to do with sexuality? I don't neessarily agree that Gwen is empathic, either. I can't remember if they use the word on the show - do they? - Jack says she's 'normal' and 'human'.
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It raises a question in my mind: what would happen if Jack dosed the Doctor with retcon?
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What reason would you give for her ability to perceive Eugene when no one else could?
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Also, I'm getting confused, are we talking telepathy or being psychic. Telepathy in my mind is being able to read other minds, psychic is being able to predict events and see what is going to come in the furture. For instance the pendant Mary gave Tosh allowed her to be telepathic but not psychic.
As for the taking her to see the Weevils. I'd say that was more to do with Gwen's empathy and her polic training. If she can be trained to read people that might make her a good candidate for reading other creaters, and therefore a good person to choose to study the Weevils. Just as Owen was taught to study people in his medical career, that made him a good candidate to study the Weevils to begin with.
Oh, and on the Eugene note - maybe she could sense him because he was projecting himself to her. It wasn't her choice to recognise his presence but rather his instead. He did have a crush on Gwen, plus, he did come back to save her. So, it makes sense that he subconciously "chose" her as the one to project himself to.
(Hehe, I'm enjoying this intense conversation a bit too much, methinks. I need more of a life.)
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This is (partly) why I don't think Gwen is empathic. But I think that even empathic and pyschic people can screw up.
Also, I'm getting confused, are we talking telepathy or being psychic. Telepathy in my mind is being able to read other minds, psychic is being able to predict events and see what is going to come in the furture.
Who things, I agree, and I was talking about Gwen possibly being psychic (not telepathic). Both involve extraordinary mind powers and I was making an extrapolation: if one person in this universe can have one sort of extraordinary mind powers, then another person might have another kind. The Doctor can also see the future, though obviously that isn't an absolute skill, because there are ultimately infinite futures.
I'd say that was more to do with Gwen's empathy and her polic training.
You believe she's an empath, then?
Just as Owen was taught to study people in his medical career, that made him a good candidate to study the Weevils to begin with.
I think everyone at Torchwood has studied Weevils, one way or another. They make an interesting case study.
Yes, Gwen's ability to hear Eugene (insofar as she could) might well have been the result of his efforts, not hers, but it does imply a certain passive ability on her part - that she was receptive. (Though it might have been fun if it had been Jack instead of Gwen!)
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Lovely icon you have there.
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From: (Anonymous)
Hi.
God bless.
From: (Anonymous)
Hi.
God bless.
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And even if it can be interpreted as a proof of Gwen's special psychic sensitivity, I still don't see it like this.
Eugene is a "starting" point here. And maybe the eye, though it wasn't actually said it was alien. It's clear, that Eugene had very strong feelings towards Gwen. And sure, she certainly was influenced by him, but I think only because he was constantly with her, and concentrated very hard ob her. This short scene with his co-worker, Linda, confirms, that he could also influence others.
And, at the very end, when he became corporeal once more, it was because he desperately wanted to save Gwen's life.
So, I'll stick to my initial statement, and say there's nothing overly special about Gwen. Except that she still cares about other people. People, who - to the rest of Torchwood stuff, may seem insignificant. Maybe that's what working for Torchwood does to you - you get so deep in alien stuff, that you sometimes forget about "mere mortals" and the pain they can feel. You get too the detached (maybe you have to?).
Oops, I this I get too philosophical at the end... *g*
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Didn't Jack confirm that it was alien?
Ther's no such thing as being 'too philosophical"!
I agree, there's no proof, and no real evidence, that Gwen is psychic. I maintain it's a possibility and I like it as a working theory. She obviously doesn't know about it, if she is.
If that isn't it, why do you think Jack sees her as an asset to Torchwood? Or is it just that he's charmed by her big eyes and cute smile?
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I think he said something like "It's fantastic". Not a definite confirmation for me, but yeah, I'm inclined to think it was alien.
If that isn't it, why do you think Jack sees her as an asset to Torchwood? Or is it just that he's charmed by her big eyes and cute smile?
I'm not sure Jack is easily charmed these days... He changed so much since his adventures with Doctor.
My interpretation was, that Jack foun
d her persistence and curiosity interesting. And Gwen obviously showed she has a strong mind, since she fought off the amnesia pill.
And maybe even Jack's aware that they've lost a bit of human touch. Because it's clear, that though they fight for the safety of human race, they also often (usually?) forget that this is not some faceless crowd, that those are real people. Gwen still remembers that, and she reminds them constantly. For me, that's what Jack wants from her - a bit of conscience and someone who's much more in the "real world" that the rest of them.
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I thought he said something describing the species - how they used these eyes to see what was behind them or what was coming. Something like that. (I love the way Jack knows so much - whatever he needs to!)
I agree that Jack uses Gwen as his conscience, at least sometimes. I'm not sure that's enough to warrant her inclusion in Torchwood, but it'll do.